Poster for Anton Shulke and Jason Barnard

Kalicube Tuesdays Special

For the two year anniversary of Kalicube Tuesdays live event series, Anton Shulke and Jason Barnard discuss their memories. Anton has been the production manager since the start and shares his favourite memories. As host, Jason has been there for every episode. If you want to know what the Kalicube Tuesdays event series is all about, this episode is perfect for you. Special mentions for Tim Soulo, Bill Slawski, Dave Davies, Barry Schwartz, Cindy Krum and many, many more!

Join Anton Shulke and Jason Barnard for this week’s special episode of Kalicube Tuesdays!

Scheduled for 16 August 2022 at 18 H CET (Paris)

The event is 100% free:

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Organised by Kalicube in partnership with Wordlift.

Part of the Kalicube Tuesdays series.

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Looking Back at the 115 Episodes of Kalicube Tuesdays With Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy) and Anton Shulke

[00:00:00] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Hi and welcome to another Kalicube Tuesdays. This is a special Kalicube Tuesdays about Kalicube Tuesdays. And the only person I can talk to about Kalicube Tuesdays as a retrospective, looking back on the 115 episodes we’ve done so far, is Anton Shulke, who’s been behind the scenes, managing everything behind the scenes for the last, what is it now, 2 years, 3 years.

[00:00:27] Anton Shulke: Yeah. Something between 2 and 3 years, 115 episodes. 

[00:00:32] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yep. But we’re into the third year. 

[00:00:35] Anton Shulke: Okay. So we’ll be close to 150 at the end of this year.

[00:00:43] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yep. We’re looking at 150 by the end of the year, 115 right now. We had the big birthday cake for the 100th episode with Carrie Rose. I believe it was a few months ago. And I wanted to start with the song. A quick hello and we’re good to go. Welcome to the show, Anton Shulke. 

[00:01:07] Anton Shulke: I wish I could sing.

[00:01:10] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): You could try. 

[00:01:11] Anton Shulke: No, not in public.

[00:01:15] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Now, I’ve just realised you’ve heard that song 230 times because I sing it at the beginning and the end. You must have been really bored of me.

[00:01:24] Anton Shulke: You missed a couple of times. I also missed a couple of episodes, but it’s 200 or put it 200 times, yes. 

[00:01:31] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): And you still love the song.

[00:01:33] Anton Shulke: Yeah. Yeah. It’s a nice one. It’s a short one.

[00:01:37] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): It’s nice because it’s short and I’ll quote you on that, Anton. Brilliant.

Examining the Brand SERP of Anton Shulke and the Brand SERP of Kalicube Tuesdays

[00:01:41] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): We always start with the Brand SERPs, so I’m not going to break from tradition. And that’s your Brand SERP. We created your website a year ago. And it now ranks number one, giving you a little bit of control over the top of that Brand SERP for yourself. The website hasn’t had quite as much of an effect as we had hoped. We initially triggered a Knowledge Panel. It then disappeared. So we’re going to have to get back to working on that. And we are definitely going to start that this month. We’ll get you a Knowledge Panel, Anton. Don’t you worry.

[00:02:10] Then I thought I’d look at the Kalicube Tuesdays’ Brand SERP. And literally and absolutely no cheating at all, Anton Shulke and Jason Barnard is one of the Rich Sitelinks. What were the chances of that? And Kalicube Tuesdays has at the top, which is an experiment we did of creating this site just for Kalicube Tuesdays, i.e. the website is the Entity Home for Kalicube Tuesdays. And it turns out that’s a really strong strategy for Brand SERPs and for Knowledge Panels. And I hope, once again, we’re trying to get a Knowledge Panel there.

[00:02:43] We’ve got the Rich Sitelinks and then just obviously lots of videos including Nik Ranger. Andrea Volpini gets in there twice, which is a bit of a cheat. Google is making a lot of sense of our Brand SERP, i.e. showing the things that people are going to want to see, which is, because Kalicube Tuesdays is a livestream series, videos.

Anton Shulke, The Livestream Guy, Is Named as One of the Top 20 B2B Influencer Marketing Experts to Follow

[00:03:03] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): And Anton Shulke, The Livestream Guy, hot news today. Here we have Lee Odden who has named Anton as one of the top 20 B2B influencer marketing experts to follow, which is an amazing achievement for you, Anton. 

[00:03:22] Anton Shulke: Yes. I was gobsmacked, but I think it’s slightly, maybe not slightly, maybe it’s only because of the Ukrainian war and my saga in Ukraine and out of Ukraine and my coffee shot post every day during my time in Ukraine. And everything rolled to me later after yesterday because he published it yesterday. And he mentioned Ukraine saga. So I probably think it’s because of the war. I wish it wouldn’t happen. I wish the war wouldn’t happen, but I’m absolutely honored and gobsmacked. 

[00:04:05] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Anton is gobsmacked. My personal opinion is you deserve it. You’re one of these people, at least within the kind of people in the industry I’m hanging out. And everybody loves you. Everyone respects you. You’ve done immense amounts for everybody. And from the Kalicube Tuesdays perspective, when you look at 115 episodes, you said you missed a couple. I think you might’ve missed 3 or 4. So you’ve been here the whole time, like WordLift as well, supporting me and this effort to share knowledge and from my perspective, to get knowledge from other people, which has been amazing.

[00:04:37] So, what we are going to do is look through the Kalicube Tuesdays archives and just discuss what we remember.

The Origin of the Name Kalicube and Its Meaning

[00:04:46] Anton Shulke: Before we go, can I ask you a question? Kalicube is a nice name. I never really know what’s the name all about. What does it mean, Kalicube? 

[00:04:56] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Right. Yeah. That’s a lovely question. We actually did a case study on managing a Brand SERP for a unique brand name, because we wanted to compare it to managing a Brand SERP for a generic brand name. So we had Backpacker Job Board, who’s a client of ours, who have managed to dominate Backpacker Job Board, which is obviously a generic term.

[00:05:18] And then we thought we’ll do a case study on Kalicube, which is a unique name. I’m a big fan of unique names because unique names, you can bring your own meaning to the name. And from my perspective, Kalicube, actually, I had some help from my friend Hugo Scott, who used to be in the band with me in the 90s. Kali, for me, sounds like quality and cube is square, simple, solid, reliable.

[00:05:45] Anton Shulke: Interesting.

[00:05:45] The Brand SERP Guy (Jason Barnard): So you’ve got solid, reliable quality is Kalicube. And then we use the falcon as this kind of a bird that flies off with some freedom, with some lightness and yet strength and power and colourful because I like colours. How does that sound? Is that logical?

Picking a Unique Name to Create Meaning Around It and Dominate the Brand SERPs

[00:06:05] Anton Shulke: It is very logical. The thing is it is very, very logical. And so, basically, you were thinking about the name of your own company with a vision of how Google would look at it and it would be unique and everything. Is it correct? 

[00:06:23] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah. The idea is to pick a unique name so that we could create meaning around it. And that meaning is the meaning that we have in our minds. So, the Kalicube brand means what you experience with Kalicube, as opposed to what you associate with a name like Backpacker Job Board. So you’ve asked me why we called it Kalicube. One is to dominate the Brand SERPs simply.

[00:06:49] The other is because I wanted to build meaning for our clients and users. And the other actually works in French and English. Qualite and quality is the same, and cube and cube is the same. So it works in French and English. And we’re a French company, so that made sense. What I am surprised about is why you didn’t ask why we called it Tuesdays.

[00:07:09] Anton Shulke: Because it’s on Tuesdays.

[00:07:11] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): One of the guests once asked us on email, can we do it on Wednesday? And my reply was which part of Kalicube Tuesdays don’t you understand? 

[00:07:24] Anton Shulke: Yeah. People tend not to read many words. So probably he only read Kalicube. Yeah. Okay. So we’re clear on the Kalicube.

How Do You Dominate in Your Brand SERP With a Name That Is Not Unique?

[00:07:35] Anton Shulke: But what about name and brand? For example, obviously, some companies they have a history of a name with been having a name for 10 or 20 years. And it’s not unique and it’s very, very not unique. So it’s very difficult. I work for Duda. And Duda as a single Duda, it is not very unique. And in several different languages has very different meaning because it’s just a noun. It’s not a name. And it’s a name for several people as well. So, I think with a name of the Duda is so difficult, how would you say, to dominate in SERP, isn’t it? 

[00:08:22] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah. Well, in terms of Knowledge Panels, you need to become the dominant entity, i.e. the entity that Google feels is dominant. And that’s a mixture of the confidence it has in its understanding and the probability that somebody is actually looking for this specific Duda, as opposed to another Duda. And becoming the dominant entity is very much geo specific. So if you have a person in Poland called Duda, it’s going to be more difficult. In France, you wouldn’t have somebody called Duda, so it’s going to be easier.

Do You Have to Rebrand if Your Brand Has a Common Name in Order to Dominate?

[00:08:54] Anton Shulke: Yeah. But you still, so for example, in Poland, you basically have very little chance with this name or in Spain, because Duda in Spanish has a meaning. The word duda means doubt. So if I’m in Spain, for example, right now, so if you’re in Spain and you are looking for duda, you probably would get, I don’t know, translate duda to English or this kind of things. Okay. It’s not about, I’m not trying to sell Duda right now, but is it those kind of companies should really think about and rebrand?

[00:09:33] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): No, in fact. You can rebrand. It’s a massive, massive, massive job. And obviously, I’m now going to set up my product with this Kalicube Pro. Dave Davies rebranded using Kalicube Pro. And he said it was one of the easiest things he’s done, because Kalicube Pro just brings up all of the reference to the old name, you go in, and you change them to the new name. And he said it took him two weeks to completely dominate his new Brand SERP, which was wonderful.

[00:09:57] So from that perspective, with a small company, it’s pretty easy. With a big company, you’ve got all your branding, all your printed materials, all of your different websites, all the different presence. That’s a major task. Facebook did it to Meta incredibly well. But in fact, you can either think about rebranding or you can think about becoming that dominant entity. And there is an application called Windy, and that dominates the Brand SERP. They have dominated their Brand SERP by the pure consistency of what they talk about, who they are, and the volume of people who actually search for Windy who are looking for this specific application.

[00:10:37] So, if you have a common name and you don’t want to change it, which is totally understandable, you simply have to work on that domination, the probability people are searching for you, and it becomes this basically traditional marketing effort to push your name out there and to get your name to mean something in people’s minds. Once it means something in people’s minds and they associate that word with you, Google will follow suit and you will dominate your Brand SERP. Windy don’t completely dominate it. There’s a couple of places for Wikipedia, for example, but definitely they’ve got 80% and the 80% that matters, which is the top.

[00:11:13] Anton Shulke: Interesting.

Presenting Some of the Guests of Kalicube Tuesdays in a Beautiful Collage of Images

[00:11:15] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): There you go. We weren’t talking about that, actually. I don’t know why we got off on that topic. Oh, because you asked me about Kalicube. What I wanted to do was show this delightful design that Veronique did. It’s not all the guests. She’s picked some guests and she’s made a lovely, colourful. For people listening in on a podcast, it’s a beautiful image, colourful photos of all the wonderful people that we’ve had on the show, looks really good. And we’ve been using that to represent Kalicube Tuesdays.

[00:11:42] And for me, that’s exactly what Kalicube Tuesdays is about. It’s amazing people sharing wonderful insights and secrets about specific topics that they know inside out that I don’t. And the colours really represent the fact that it’s fun and enjoyable, as well as being helpful and interesting. You recognise loads of the people, in fact, all of the people on that, Anton. 

[00:12:06] Anton Shulke: Yes, all of the people. And I also immediately recognised Bill’s last picture.

[00:12:12] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah.

[00:12:13] Anton Shulke: Unfortunately he died.

[00:12:17] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah. He was wonderful when he came on. It was incredibly geeky. And I absolutely loved it because he always answered all the questions, incredibly straightforwardly and incredibly helpfully. And I always, always, always got so much out of him. Who else stands out there other than the wonderful Bill Slawski?

[00:12:38] Anton Shulke: Yeah. All right.

[00:12:39] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): For you.

[00:12:39] Anton Shulke: Yeah. I don’t know. It’s such a difficult choice. I’m not going to go with it. I’m not going to go pick anyone in particular, but I can see most of those people are SEOs or some people probably content marketing more than SEOs, but most of them are really, or some PR as well.

Mentioning Some of the Guests and Remembering the Experiences Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy) Had With Them

[00:13:01] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah. I’m not picking anyone because I particularly think that the episode was better than anybody else’s because every episode is always wonderful, but somebody like David Bain. I loved his pump and funnel marketing explanation. Dave Davies, I really enjoyed chatting to him about the SERPs. I love the way Dave Davies writes, the way he speaks, how well he explains all of the stuff that he knows. Danny Goodwin gave my first opportunity to write on Search Engine Journal. He was wonderful. Erin Sparks, I keep hanging out with him despite myself and he’s so much fun and share so much immense.

[00:13:36] Anton Shulke: And I think only Nik Ranger came with a presentation. And you had to explain every single slide for, I want to say radio listeners, for podcast audio listeners. Yeah. But this was a funny anyway thing. Yeah.

[00:13:57] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah, no, that was brilliant with Nik Ranger. It was wonderful presentation. And explaining the slides as we went along was actually quite a lot of fun. And next to her is Mads Singers. What I loved about that one is that he’s this guy with this incredibly, what would you say, masterful presentation of how to run a business. And ever since then, within the Kalicube team, we cite Mads Singers very often. His advice about running a company is amazing.

[00:14:25] And then below there I see Rebecca and Koray. They were so, so amazing. They’re two of my favourite people, smartest people I know in the industry. And Kevin Indig, incredibly delightful as well, Cindy Krum, wonderful, Barry Schwartz. What I liked about Barry Schwartz is he came on and I managed to make him laugh. And that was my whole point in the Kalicube Tuesdays with Barry Schwartz is can I make him laugh. And I did. So I’m proud of myself on that one.

[00:14:59] Anton Shulke: Tim Soulo.

[00:15:00] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yep. He came on about a month after the start of the Ukraine war and was incredibly informative. And he has family in Ukraine. Immense kudos to him for coming on and being able to concentrate on something else for half an hour. He was amazing.

Deciding to Do the First Season Because the Pandemic Isn’t Going to End Soon and Completing 31 Episodes

[00:15:22] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): So, we have now into season three, and I’ve actually got the list. And you say you can’t read them, but what I was going to do is show the three seasons here. There you have the first season. It was 31 episodes. We started with James Mulvany in June. And it was you who told me to start. You said, you are not going to any conferences anytime soon. COVID isn’t going to end. We need to do this online. Do you remember that? 

[00:15:48] Anton Shulke: Yeah, but it was the only choice and everyone did it. Yeah. I remember you were doing it personally. And you did it with one person and a lot of people. And obviously, it’s more fun doing it personally, of course, but COVID didn’t leave much chance.

[00:16:11] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): No. And you were saying a lot of the people in that photo are SEOs. And I think actually that’s probably a bias from our perspective. Because when I look at this list, we’ve got James Mulvany, Dr. Addison-Zhang. We’ve got Bengu Atamer, David Avrin, Neal Schaffer, Patrick M Powers, Ryan Foland, Matthew Tenney, Ted Rubin, and Rand Fishkin. And up to Rand Fishkin there, none of them are SEOs. 

[00:16:41] Anton Shulke: Yeah. And Rand Fishkin is on that panel, that picture, and probably none of them. Yeah.

I don’t think SEO exists in a vacuum and I don’t think you can just look at SEO. If you don’t look at the rest, you’re not doing your job even as an SEO expert.

Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy)

[00:16:50] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah. We started off in a very marketing angle and then moved. I’m hoping that we are mixing marketing with SEO, because I obviously come from SEO. And I would like from now on to move more towards marketing, because I don’t think SEO exists in a vacuum and I don’t think you can just look at SEO. If you don’t look at the rest, you’re not doing your job even as an SEO expert. 

[00:17:15] Anton Shulke: No, of course not. Even technical SEO is not very, very separate, but obviously now this content marketing. And yes, you are very, very close as well. Other part of marketing is probably as important. We just or at least I’m looking for myself. I just don’t know those community as well as SEO. 

[00:17:41] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Right. Yeah. We had Barnaby Wynter. I remember him very clearly because he had a bucket theory of funnels. And I misunderstood. And I asked him to start at the bottom and work up his seven step bucket theory. And at the end he said, but I’m supposed to go from the top to the bottom and you made me go from the bottom to the top. And what was nice about that is having said, that was the wrong way around, Jason, and it was really difficult for me. He’s actually now put that on his site as his favourite interview. So maybe making it a little bit difficult for people is a good thing. 

[00:18:14] Anton Shulke: Yeah. But probably if you’re doing it for a few years, you should be very able to go eight points from to other way around.

Having 56 Episodes for the Second Season of Kalicube Tuesdays

[00:18:25] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah, no. And that first season, I really thought that was going to be the first season, then I’d be off around the world again interviewing people face to face. And that simply didn’t happen, as we all know. And we moved into season two, and we went totally bonkers, 56 episodes in 2021. I suspect we were just bored.

[00:18:51] Anton Shulke: Yeah. I think almost everyone is. For example, why Netflix and Zoom made so much money and became such a big names. Actually, Netflix is probably not doing very well now. Maybe about people just now have wanted to travel and everything. Yeah, of course. What else would you do? I remember looking at not only Kalicube but any kind of webinars and everything. So, everyone had first really influence. We got double audience because everyone went there.

[00:19:28] But after that, everyone went to do episodes. Everyone went to do podcast and webinars and livestreams. And there were so many, so our audience basically disappear because it was split, so many of them. So at the beginning, it was easy. And after that, it was very, very difficult to get audience.

The Experiences of Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy) in Doing a Livestream 

[00:19:50] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Right. Yeah. And that is the thing that’s proliferated. So there’s an awful lot of podcasts and events and webinars. And getting the audience in is actually becoming more and more difficult. But at the same time, we are doing okay. We’re getting over a hundred views on YouTube for every episode, but we never get much of a live audience. And I’m wondering what we’re doing wrong there. 

[00:20:13] Anton Shulke: Yeah. My experience about live audience always, you have to have a big, big at least. Okay. Normal rate is about, I don’t know, one-third. So if people register, if you allow people to register, which is a good idea, because it will send people a reminder and everything. Maybe one-third of it will come for live. Otherwise, people say why should I watch live? I can watch or listen later.

[00:20:44] And I don’t know. It’s probably, it’s like a vicious circle. If you have plenty of live, people watching you, you have many more questions or comments. So you’re talking to your audience, and it will give extra dimension to your livestream. But if you don’t, originally, you don’t have them, so basically your livestream or you podcast would be as good in recording as good as live. Don’t motivate people to really go in time and watch it live. 

[00:21:27] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Right, yeah, no. The thing about Kalicube Tuesdays is I really enjoy doing it live because on a Tuesday, let’s say, at three o’clock in the afternoon, I really don’t feel like turning up and doing an interview. And the fact that it’s live forces me to do it. And I think forcing myself to do it. I enjoy every single one. So, I turn up dragging my feet, thinking I’m not really up for this. And then as soon as the conversation starts, I’m happy as a lark.

Mentioning More Guests and Doing Passing the Baton With Them Which Is Used for Social Media Promotion

[00:21:52] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): And here I’m noticing Olesia Korobka. We did about image SEO. That was really wonderful. She’s so smart and brought an awful lot to the table that I still haven’t fully investigated. And now, I can see here a year ago. And I remember as well, so I’m looking down the list, Teodora Petkova, who comes up with these amazing ideas about semantics and the semantic web. And I sit there and just my mouth open thinking, oh, I wish I knew all that. I wish I could keep up with what she’s talking about. We had Russ Jeffrey as well from Duda.

[00:22:31] And now, I’m looking down the list and we’ve got Gennaro Cuofano. And that was the first episode where we did passing the baton. And he passed the baton to Simon Cox. I love passing the bat. 

[00:22:45] Anton Shulke: It’s very difficult from the point of view that’s left and right and because it’s a mirror image, so nobody can do it right on their first try. And eventually, people decide not to do the visual thing that you say. Okay. I’m fine passing the baton.

[00:23:04] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): I’m getting better at it, but then I’ve done a hundred of these, so I immediately think I know it’s that way around. But it is funny because everyone’s going, oh, is it left or right because it’s all back to front. And passing the baton is fun just in the sense that we can then use it for the social media promotion for the next week’s Kalicube Tuesdays.

[00:23:24] And I’m getting slightly concerned that I won’t find anything interesting to say or that little snippet won’t be as good. And sometimes, I don’t get it quite right, but the guest always pulls me out of the water as it were. So, there you go. We’ve got the passing the baton. The batting of the baton started with Gennaro Cuofano. I’m going to check on that. It was about, I think it was September time. So we’ve now done almost a year of passing the baton. It goes so quickly.

Moving on to Season Three and Doing Monthly Specials With WordLift About Semantic SEO and Knowledge Graphs

[00:23:57] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): And then onto season three, which we’re in the middle of now. We’re up to episode 27. And this year we’ve been doing monthly round table specials with WordLift, very geeky, all about semantic SEO and Knowledge Graphs. And they’ve been amazing. So it’s been two Kalicube Tuesdays once a month with WordLift.

[00:24:26] And we’ve talked about building Knowledge Graphs, semantic SEO, over and over and over again. And they seem to have an immense number of topics to talk about where we did one last week with Matt Artz and Emilija. That was brilliant. I really enjoyed that. Matt Artz, who’s an anthropologist. I was too ashamed to ask him to tell me what an anthropologist is. But he ended up, sorry, go ahead.

[00:24:55] Anton Shulke: You should, because I don’t know. 

[00:24:59] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): No. Exactly. And then I asked him afterwards and he said, oh, you should have asked because most people don’t know what one is. And then he was talking about with knowledge. He was talking about known knowns, known unknowns, unknown knowns, and unknown unknowns. And I didn’t dare ask him to explain that either. And I’m hoping to have him on the podcast in a couple of months so that he can just explain that concept, because he’s absolutely brilliant.

Some of the Difficulties Faced in Doing Podcasts Since It Is Nonvisual 

[00:25:26] Anton Shulke: I think some things are very difficult to explain without visuals. It’s why there is a difference between actually livestream or webinar, whatever you call it, and the podcast, classical audio podcast. And it’s very, very, very different. So, explaining what you said, I can’t even repeat what you said right now, known, unknown, known, unknown, known, and all those kind of things. But explain it just in audio conversation, I think it would be extremely, extremely difficult. But with some visuals, I think would be much easier. So probably this is a good topic for video thing, for webinar.

[00:26:08] I think this is very different things. Kalicube managed to do both, I think, reasonably well. Because maybe for the sake of audio version, you don’t go very, very, very technical. But as I said, some things would be very difficult to explain. But I’ve seen many podcasts which has a video version, and usually one of the version is not doing very well because podcast is very nonvisual. For obvious reason, you drive in a car, you can listen to your podcast.

[00:26:47] But some technical things needs to have visuals because maybe mostly we’re doing video things. So some technical needs to be explaining with the visual things, if you cannot do it on a podcast. And webinar also, you can have more people than two. On a podcast, we try to have more people than two. And usually, it doesn’t work really very well because it’s so difficult to, especially if you have, I don’t know, three men, for example. It’s so difficult to distinguish who’s talking. On the video, it’s much, much easier.

[00:27:23] So it’s why I think what you are doing is you’re trying to go this way, trying to please both worlds, and it’s not easy. Maybe this is a reason why we don’t have that many live views, because our views is still more podcast than livestream.

[00:27:47] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah, no, that’s true. And as you say, it’s a very delicate line and Nik Ranger being the extreme, which was actually fun, but I’d be intrigued to know if anybody actually enjoyed that podcast, if it’s maybe even more fun because of all the explanations or if it just doesn’t make sense.

The Struggle in Following Slides or Anything Shown on Screen in Audio Conversations Only 

[00:28:06] Anton Shulke: I think it is very, very difficult to follow slides on audio. 

[00:28:13] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Yeah.

[00:28:15] Anton Shulke: It depends on the slides. I recently had a webinar with Chris Simmons, and he’s talking about agencies and coach. And I said, okay, it’s a webinar so let’s have slides. And he brought the slides. Every slide will just have something written on it and that’s it, nothing else. We eventually figured out that the main thing is he wanted to put a gif image, which would be moving, but the system just didn’t accept gif.

[00:28:54] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Oh, right.

[00:28:54] Anton Shulke: So he removed the gif and eventually he ended up with just every slide with a written on it, which makes no sense. We rectified it, put it on every slide, but this is a thing. Those kind of slides is very easy for you to go on audio, but they make no sense on video.

[00:29:18] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): No.

[00:29:19] Anton Shulke: And slides which makes a lot of sense on video would be very, very difficult. Okay. You have a chart. Explain the chart. It’s so broadly difficult. That’s why I think it’s so delicate line and maybe most of the people shouldn’t do it. 

[00:29:36] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): No, yeah, no. I think it is difficult. And the other thing is sometimes you put up things on screen, little comment to the bottom or a screenshot that illustrates what we were talking about. And at that point, we have to say, for those listening on audio or only on the podcast, we’ve just seen a screen that shows 1.66 billion searches a second by Google. I think that was what one of them was. I’d be actually very, very surprised if it was that number, but I remember you put the number of searches per second or something during one of the episodes.

[00:30:07] But that, basically for me, is it. We’ve got three seasons and still going of Kalicube Tuesdays. It’s been absolutely wonderful. 115 episodes. Anton Shulke, the man behind the stream and the screen, The Livestream Guy, Anton Shulke. Thank you very much.

What Are the Plans of Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy) With Doing Face-to-Face and Online Interviews? 

[00:30:27] Anton Shulke: Yeah. I have another question you have to answer.

[00:30:29] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Oh, no.

[00:30:29] Anton Shulke: So what are the plans? Are you going to go back to a real conversation and the real interview? Or are you going to go and do it online you used to for last 115 episodes?

[00:30:44] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Right. Yeah. I actually went and tried to do some face-to-face interviews. And I’ve forgotten how so I’m going to have to get back into that. I find it now very difficult looking into people’s eyes, which is what I did before. So I’m going to have to train myself back up to look in people’s eyes and have that face-to-face relationship. But I think that’s a very common post-COVID problem is that we’ve done so much on screen that when you’re face to face, you feel a little bit uncomfortable and a little bit out of place.

[00:31:14] But definitely, I want to go back to doing face-to-face interviews because I enjoy them so much. I think I’ll probably do it without the video because the video makes it too complicated and makes me doubly nervous. But I’m going to keep going with the Kalicube Tuesdays because it’s regular, it’s fun, and building up this content with really smart people, who are teaching us stuff, is really, really powerful.

The Plans for the Future of Kalicube Tuesdays: Focusing More on General Marketing Than SEO

[00:31:41] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): And what we’ve got coming up, in fact, we were talking about SEOs and non-SEOs is as from August, i.e. next month, September, October, we’re looking to expand much more. We’re putting in people from a totally different universe. And we’re having somebody coming on, for example, to talk about TikTok, how to get TikTok working for your business. Somebody else saying how to make money even in midlife on your own as a remote worker.

[00:32:09] So trying to spread it out to different ideas about marketing, about online activities to build your business, to build your personal brand. And I’m really looking forward to it. Less focus on SEO, so instead of 80-20 in favour of SEO, it’s going to be 80-20 in favour of general marketing. That’s going to be great. 

[00:32:29] Anton Shulke: Okay. Fantastic. Now you can finish. 

[00:32:33] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Thank you very much, Anton. That was absolutely delightful. The retrospective on Kalicube Tuesdays, 115 episodes, three seasons, still going. Thank you, everyone, who watches this online and listens to it as a podcast. You get the outro song for the 231st time. A quick goodbye to end the show. Thank you, Anton.

[00:32:57] Anton Shulke: Thank you, Jason.

[00:32:58] Jason Barnard (The Brand SERP Guy): Kalicube, it’s all about your Brand SERP.

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